Another DOS missing dose thread

**iamchadster** · 05-05-2015

I can say that I have been tracking this issue since February and feel your frustration. There were certainly times when I wanted to and did change my programming just to get the random error to stop occurring. I spent many hours watching for clues or signs of why and how the unit was short dosing my tank for my AWC. I was convinced that the unit was bad and almost begged Paul to send another one to prove that it couldn't be a firmware issue but the hardware was bad. Paul said to keep an eye on things and he was sure that it wasn't related to the unit and assured me they were working on a fix.

My goal was to own 2 DOS units, one for AWC and the other for 2 part. There was no way I was gonna set up 2 part dosing and have my tank blown if the dosing wasn't accurate so I wasn't too excited to get another unit. It didn't matter as they were sold out for so long but finally I was able to get my hands on a second DOS and swapped them out one night anxiously to prove Paul wrong but low and behold the dreaded short dose bug reared it's ugly head on the new unit. So for another 2 or 3 months I observed and reported everything I saw to Neptune as asked. I even set up a test controller in the garage as I had a spare running as basic of programming as I could but I would still get an occasional error in the dosed amount reported; and for me, always on the left side. Never the right.

Fast forward to the release date of the PC firmware upgrade:

I was able to update to the new firmware when it was released and can report that I have had perfect dosing since. No shortages, no errors and every other parameter such as salinity etc. that may change if one side wasn't balanced with the other etc, are all staying rock solid. IMO, the bug has been fixed based on my own observations. I am also seeing less reports of dosing issues in the forum which could be a coincidence or others are seeing better results too.

I only post this as I can tell you that I believe these to be great units. I am pretty confident that if you gave some more info on what was going on with your firmware update process that we could get your running. If all else fails an email to Neptune systems works very well. We have been fighting and dealing with this issue for some time and now that I believe it's fixed I think you would be selling yourself short if you didn't use the new firmware.

**Lakelivin** · 05-06-2015

Hi Chad, I'm glad to hear your problem appears to have been fixed with the latest beta firmware release. I installed the first beta release and the problem went away so I assumed it was resolved. However, a couple weeks later it starting missing an average of one dose per week again. Consequently, I decided I would hold off applying the latest fix until my problem either gets worse or the non beta firmware update is released.

The bottom line is when it comes to software updates of any kind I usually avoid beta releases unless my problem is so bad that I have little other choice. I monitor this forum pretty regularly so if I see that everyone is still satisfied with the current beta release after another couple weeks or so I will go ahead and apply it. I'm just in no hurry at this point because the issue is not causing me any real problems at this point.

**Lakelivin** · 05-07-2015

I noticed the beta is now a official release so I'll load it sometime today probably.

Updated firmware a few minutes ago so hopefully the missed DOS issue is in my rearview mirror. I also ordered the free roller replacements and was informed they are in the mail. I don't believe my current rollers are causing any problems but figured I would replace them with the new version anyway.

**Lakelivin** · 05-12-2015

I applied the latest firmware release 5 days ago and my DOS missed another dose this morning. I also received the new pump rollers yesterday so I will swap them out later today. Not sure the rollers have anything to do with the issue but we will see.

**damonbrodie** · 05-12-2015

The rollers won't help that issue. I also applied the firmware and I've had a few missing doses too.

**Lakelivin** · 05-21-2015

Still missing a dose here and there with no rhyme or reason. I've been keeping track of the times and amount of doses that are missed but there is no pattern other than it "was" always the left pump. Today the right pump missed a dose according to the logs so I give up trying to keep tracking this issue.

As long as it remains only a small dose or two a week I'm not going to concern myself with it anymore. I'm sure Neptune will eventually get it figured out.

**damonbrodie** · 05-22-2015

Yep, same here. Mine randomly misses on both sides. On average it misses 2 per day. It seems random and it happens on both pumps. If I was dosing two part I wouldn't be happy with this, but with AWC, seems like not a big deal.

**Lakelivin** · 05-22-2015

Originally Posted by damonbrodie

Yep, same here. Mine randomly misses on both sides. On average it misses 2 per day. It seems random and it happens on both pumps. If I was dosing two part I wouldn't be happy with this, but with AWC, seems like not a big deal.

Agreed... I would not use the DOS for anything other than AWC's anyway. They make way too much noise to keep in a tank cabinet if maintaining a quiet tank is a concern. They are especially loud now that both pumps have developed the clicking sound to go along with the usual whine the pumps make.

**iamchadster** · 05-22-2015

I unfortunately have to agree. The clicking sound does seem to be related to the larger or post 5000 serial number rollers. I had a fix for the original roller configuration in that a little gasket grease quieted the point where the roller housing and motor mount on the dos body met. This clicking seems to be like a plastic flexing sound as a result of the pressure placed on it by the larger rollers. Hope someone comes up with a solution as it is a bit annoying. I liked the sound of just the dos motors as they are on my 2000 serial number dos that I haven't swapped rollers out yet on. Don't know if I should now as I am not losing prime at all. Maybe I should order the recalled size. ??

**Lakelivin** · 05-23-2015

Originally Posted by iamchadster

I unfortunately have to agree. The clicking sound does seem to be related to the larger or post 5000 serial number rollers. I had a fix for the original roller configuration in that a little gasket grease quieted the point where the roller housing and motor mount on the dos body met. This clicking seems to be like a plastic flexing sound as a result of the pressure placed on it by the larger rollers. Hope someone comes up with a solution as it is a bit annoying. I liked the sound of just the dos motors as they are on my 2000 serial number dos that I haven't swapped rollers out yet on. Don't know if I should now as I am not losing prime at all. Maybe I should order the recalled size. ??

Yeah, from what I can tell the clicking sound is definitely caused by the plastic flexing. I don't know if Neptune thinks this is normal or if the plastic is engineered to resist developing stress fractures with the constant flexing but time will tell I guess. I was getting the clicking sound from one of my pumps with the original rollers installed. It was only after installing the new rollers that the other pump developed the clicking sound as well.

Neptune has re-opened my last case reference missing doses so I'll let you know what the results of their investigation are.

**iamchadster** · 05-23-2015

Yeah please do. I really didn't have issues with the original rollers on the earlier serial numbers. Mine held prime just fine but didn't want to be left behind if the new rollers were better. So I'm stuck right now with one dos pre 5000 serial numbers with old rollers that keeps prime fine and a set of replacemt rollers that I haven't swapped. My other dos post 5000 serial number that creeks and cracks like crazy when it runs. I can handle the motor noise but I defimetly hate the cracking sound coming from both pumps. I just can't imagine Neptune would be ok with them like that. Some either you and I are just unlucky and have squeaky plastic or there is a bigger issue. Time will tell.

**damonbrodie** · 05-23-2015

Neptune preemptively opened a case yesterday for my missing doses. They asked me to disable clock autoset:

Thank you for your inquiry. Great information, I would like to see if you could go into the AquaController Display screen and verify whether 'Auto-Clock' is Enabled? Go to SYSTEM> CLOCK SETUP> and look for an option called

Auto Set:

Could you make sure that is set to OFF?

It has been about 12 hours since I've made the change - we'll see if that helps them narrow down the problem.

**Lakelivin** · 05-23-2015

I went ahead and set my clock to off as well.

**Lakelivin** · 05-29-2015

Update... It's been five days since turning the auto clock function off and no missed doses or clock problems so far. Let's hope the streak continues.

**damonbrodie** · 05-29-2015

Its been a week since I did the same - I've missed 3-4 doses since. I've been working it continuously with Neptune Support - they seem to be focusing in on clock drift. I feel like they are doing a great job in trying to narrow down the issue.

**Lakelivin** · 05-29-2015

Originally Posted by damonbrodie

Its been a week since I did the same - I've missed 3-4 doses since. I've been working it continuously with Neptune Support - they seem to be focusing in on clock drift. I feel like they are doing a great job in trying to narrow down the issue.

So far my clock is spot on and is staying synced with the clock on my Macbook. Support has been staying in contact with me as well and monitoring things so I have no doubt they'll figure it out.

**damonbrodie** · 05-29-2015

Originally Posted by Lakelivin

So far my clock is spot on and is staying synced with the clock on my Macbook. Support has been staying in contact with me as well and monitoring things so I have no doubt they'll figure it out.

Yes, mine is drifting - I'm off by about a minute now since I turned off autoset.

**simpletty|** · 06-08-2015

Same issue here, been experiencing the new salt water always being low. I am adding approx 550 ml to the fresh salt mix every water change. New heads installed and calibrated as well. This used to be spot on a month or so ago. Never had any issues, now misses every single change

**Lakelivin** · 06-16-2015

It's been a couple weeks since my last post so I thought I would update my situation. Neptune support is working an open ticket and from time to time sends me a message asking a question and I gave them access to my setup via Fusion so I assume they are still working on the issue. Oddly enough my missing doses problem seems to have migrated to the right pump when it was the left pump in the beginning.

It's still just a random dose no more frequent than a dose every 24hr period so it's causing no real harm or significant affect on my water parameters. I've been using DOS for AWC's for a little over 4 months now and the tank is doing great. I'm thinking of doing a large one time WC of about 25 gallons (my tank is 130 gallons including sump) just for grins. However, at this point I have had no problem with algae or high nitrates or phosphates. I'm not running any media in my reactors and just have been cleaning the glass every few days and changing filter socks regularly. Consequently, I'm very happy I decided to spend the money on my setup and overall even with the missed doses, daily/continuous water changes has been a huge success for me.

**iamchadster** · 06-16-2015

Any issues with the clicking or cracking sounds coming from your heads. Mine still sound like plastic under high tension clicking and I thought with time it would get better but has not.

**Lakelivin** · 06-17-2015

Originally Posted by iamchadster

Any issues with the clicking or cracking sounds coming from your heads. Mine still sound like plastic under high tension clicking and I thought with time it would get better but has not.

Yes, still have the clicking sound on both sides. I mentioned the issue to tech support as part of my open case I have with them and they replied "troubleshooting "sounds" is under investigation".

I thought I read in one of these DOS threads that someone received replacement roller covers that were a little more heavy duty and I believe he indicated the loud clicking/stressing plastic sound went away. When he was asked to post some pics and more details he never responded.

**iamchadster** · 06-17-2015

Yes you are right on. He didn't reply, I and one other asked for the info and we got nothing. Maybe they were the same after all who knows. I received the bigger rollers as a replacement on my old serial number dos and own a recent serial number dos. My newer dos has the clicking and cracking sounds which are tremendously annoying. The bigger rollers seem to force the plastic to bend and move in a way that results in this noise. My old dos with the smaller rollers doesn't make the noise and I hesitate to swap the rollers as I have no back siphon issue on that one.

I haven't opened a ticket as I was sure that this issue would generate more buzz than it has. It almost seems like everyone is just kind of accepting what they have now as good enough forgetting the level of precision I and many expect from these products. I am glad you have Neptune looking at the noise issue and can give any support in the way of video etc if needed.

**Lakelivin** · 06-17-2015

I had the clicking sound coming from my left pump from day one with the old rollers still installed. After receiving the upgraded/new rollers the clicking sound now comes from both sides. My guess is that Neptune has probably fixed the problem with heavier duty/thicker plastic covers based on the other users thread we both referenced. However, they are probably in no hurry to roll out replacement covers to the masses unless you are really persistent or your covers have actually broken.

**Lakelivin** · 07-11-2015

It's been a little over 3 weeks since my last update. Still missing a dose periodically but not enough to make a significant difference in water parameters so I'm not terribly concerned and I'm confident the issue will eventually get sorted out.

Pump covers are still making a terrible clicking and cracking sound. I'm sure they were not designed to sound/act that way so I suspect they will eventually develop stress cracks and/or break and become a problem. I read somewhere that there are new covers with a little different design available but will wait to track down a set when/if one or both of my current covers fail. If anyone has recent info on the issue I would love to hear about it. I have a open work order with Neptune concerning both issues for quite some time and have not heard anything in quite awhile.

**iamchadster** · 07-11-2015

I'm in exactly the same boat as you! There is no way that my units would pass a QA test the way they sound. I used to like the motor sound of the DOS now I just tolerate the clicking and popping sound they make when they run.