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Thread: DOS and AWC (Automatic Water Change)

  1. #1
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    DOS and AWC (Automatic Water Change)

    I'm thinking of getting a DOS to do AWC for me. However I'm looking for a float switch that I can put at the bottom of my fresh saltwater so that I can disable it when I run out. Most of the float switches I can find do not recomend having them be submerged. Was wondering what people have done for this?

    Thanks!

  2. #2
    Master Control Freak RussM's Avatar
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    I've never had an issue with float switches being submerged. I only use Madison and Chicago Sensor brands switches though. I have heard of people having problems with the cheapies sold on eBay.
    Please do not send me PMs with technical questions or requesting assistance - use the forums for Apex help. PM me ONLY if the matter is of a private or personal nature. Thanks.

  3. #3
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    Avast Marine also sells pressure switches if you prefer not to use floats...I have used one now for over a year with no issues, no moving parts exposed to salt.

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    Thanks for the suggestion of Avast Marine that seems like it would be simplest to use.

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    Almost there my DOS finally shipped and so have been following some other threads and will end up with something like this.

    1) Using an Avast Marine Pressure sensor to detect if the NSW is low. Great thing is that the sensor comes with a location to run a tube through so everything will be near each other.
    2) From looking over other peoples threads I setup a new Brute trash can for the NSW rather than use my existing mix can. Couple of reasons for this. First is that any residue from mixing will be mostly concentrated in the mix can rather than the NSW can, secondary solves my problem of suspending the AWC while mixing up new salt, just transfer via a pump from the mix to the NSW whenever I get a mix setup.

    So looking for some advice. Is everyone running the DOS to add NSW and remove OSW at the same time and just positioning the input and output or are you running remove first then add? I imagine with this configuration I would need to suspend my top off during this interval.

    Also I have a low and high sensor for my sump. I'm thinking I'll suspend the AWC if the high sensor is hit but ignore the low sensor?

    Finally I have some leak detectors so I figure I'll suspend the AWC if these are tripped too.

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    Another thought anyone see a need to heat and or circulate the NSW given it would have been mixed and warmed in the mix can? I'm thinking I will just put a small powerhead to keep things stirred up but not worry about heating it since the AWC will be adding it fairly slowly so shouldn't have to worry about shocking the system. Although a little concerned if the NSW would separate at lower temps?

    I'm so excited to automate the WC.

  7. #7
    Master Control Freak RussM's Avatar
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    Add first then remove or add & remove concurrently. Then you don't need to suppress ATO.
    Please do not send me PMs with technical questions or requesting assistance - use the forums for Apex help. PM me ONLY if the matter is of a private or personal nature. Thanks.

  8. #8
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    Hi seattle reef,

    I made this question just yesterday, and the sugestion of RussM was to do same time.

    About temp, I dont know the sizes of your tank, but this is a issue when you make large water changes, with small portions like DOS, I am sure it will not be a problem.
    If you are worried about this, just put NSW in return pump in sump that will mix very fast in the way to tank.

  9. #9
    Frequent Contributor zombie's Avatar
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    Temp wont be an issue as long as each individual water change does not exceed 1% of total tank volume (calculation assumes your house is no less than 70 degrees, tank temp is no greater than 80 degrees, and acceptable temp deviation is 0.2 degrees)

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by seattlereef View Post
    Almost there my DOS finally shipped and so have been following some other threads and will end up with something like this.

    1) Using an Avast Marine Pressure sensor to detect if the NSW is low. Great thing is that the sensor comes with a location to run a tube through so everything will be near each other.
    2) From looking over other peoples threads I setup a new Brute trash can for the NSW rather than use my existing mix can. Couple of reasons for this. First is that any residue from mixing will be mostly concentrated in the mix can rather than the NSW can, secondary solves my problem of suspending the AWC while mixing up new salt, just transfer via a pump from the mix to the NSW whenever I get a mix setup.

    So looking for some advice. Is everyone running the DOS to add NSW and remove OSW at the same time and just positioning the input and output or are you running remove first then add? I imagine with this configuration I would need to suspend my top off during this interval.

    Also I have a low and high sensor for my sump. I'm thinking I'll suspend the AWC if the high sensor is hit but ignore the low sensor?

    Finally I have some leak detectors so I figure I'll suspend the AWC if these are tripped too.
    I am running the dos and am running concurrently just to minimize the length of time the pump is on and making noise. Although at 25ml per min they are pretty quiet I can still hear them when they run. They are quieter than my brs dosers were but nonetheless just prefer to run this way. Just be sure the out is upstream in your sump and the in is closer to the return pump.
    Chad

  11. #11
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    DOS and AWC (Automatic Water Change)

    Thanks for the advice waiting for the ups guy like he's santa

  12. #12
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    Hi seattlereef,

    Zombie also made sugestions for me that maybe will be enjoyed by you.
    This is the thread:
    https://forum.neptunesystems.com/sho...c-water-change

  13. #13
    Frequent Contributor iamchadster's Avatar
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    Hi,

    Just a couple of things I learned over the weekend with the DOS.

    Using the fusion wizard is slick but as you will see in other posts, as well as my experience the dos was coming on way too much for me. I was moving about a gallon a day over 24 doses which came out to about 157ml or so. Using the wizard and simply plugging in those numbers I was getting a dose about every 10 minutes. Although it is likely NO issue whatsoever for these amazing pumps I much preferred to space my add and remove of saltwater over a 24 hour period dosing only once per hour.

    This to me had several advantages. I was initially using BRS dosers so not running them very long was why I initially spaced it out so much and found that it was easier to catch issues if they were to occur. Maybe you NSW salinity isn't quite right, or a tube pops off a pump or gets clogged or leaks etc. Seeing your pH or salinity creep up vs taking a big jump is just more appealing to me. Also, the noise is going to be a factor. I have the pump mounted on the inside of my cabinet. When it runs at 250ml/min you will definitely hear it. I have found that I like the tone and level at 25ml/min and don't consider it much louder than some of my other equipment. In fact I will go as far as to say the sound is kind of cool. Really geeky......Also I have other programming that depends on the dos pumps being in an "on" or "off" state. If you are using the tbl "wizard" data then the dos pump will always appear to be in the on state to your other programming as I understand it. I have a solenoid that I only wanted open during dosing as an upstream safety to my incoming NSW pump.

    So......
    With a little help from Aquamaniac and Zombie it finally dawned on me to go back to using the osc command that I used with BRS dosers and a Profile that told the DOS how much to dose and at what rate etc. You have to do a little math but it's not hard.

    If you want to dose a specific amount as I am doing then here is my programming. Hope it helps.

    Virutal outlet WATERCHANGE

    Set OFF
    OSC 000:00/007:00/053:00 Then ON
    If Outlet Leak = ON Then OFF

    Advanced Programming in each dos outlet

    Fallback OFF
    Set OFF
    If Outlet WATERCHANGE = ON Then NSWOSW
    If Outlet NSWFAST = ON Then FAST---------------------------I created a outlet in my old salt water pump as well called OSWFAST.
    If Outlet Leak = ON Then OFF

    Create a profile (I called mine NSWOSW) that specifies rate, amt, etc.
    I created a separate profile called FAST that runs at 250ml/min and I made a virtual outlet for each that I can just turn on or off that will activate the FAST profile if I choose.

    This provides me 157ml of NSW/OSW at 25ml/min which works out to about 6min which will vary based on your calibration of each pump. The 7 minutes in the osc statement allows the dos to be on for enough time to allow that amount to be dosed. The dos stays "off" for 53 minutes and doses another 157ml at the top of the next hour etc.
    Chad

  14. #14
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    Got my DOS yesterday. Got everything ready and changing out 10,500 ml each day now ~2.75 gallon a day / ~20 gallons a week on my tank. Setup was fairly easy and took me around an hour setting everything up.

    For me the DOS coming on alot is fine given that its located in my garage so noise is a non issue.

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    Quote Originally Posted by seattlereef View Post
    Got my DOS yesterday. Got everything ready and changing out 10,500 ml each day now ~2.75 gallon a day / ~20 gallons a week on my tank. Setup was fairly easy and took me around an hour setting everything up.

    For me the DOS coming on alot is fine given that its located in my garage so noise is a non issue.
    How far are you pumping water with your DOS from the garage? I'm about to do the same but will need to go up 10ft, over 50ft, then back down 10 to the sump. Running all of that is the hardest part.

    Thanks

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by TX_Punisher View Post
    How far are you pumping water with your DOS from the garage? I'm about to do the same but will need to go up 10ft, over 50ft, then back down 10 to the sump. Running all of that is the hardest part.

    Thanks
    That guy posted 3 years ago, so it is unlikely he will respond.

    The run you are planning is within the capabilities of the DOS, you just need to make sure you get tubing that will hold up to pulling that long of a distance without damaging it in the process. I would get polyethyline that is a bit more rigid than the neptune tubing in a 1/4" OD, 5/32" ID (1/8" can work too but it's even harder to get on). This is a b!tch to get on the DOS heads, but if you warm the ends of the tubing with boiling water and then put them on the DOS head they will seal nicely.

    Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk

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    Quote Originally Posted by zombie View Post
    That guy posted 3 years ago, so it is unlikely he will respond.

    The run you are planning is within the capabilities of the DOS, you just need to make sure you get tubing that will hold up to pulling that long of a distance without damaging it in the process. I would get polyethyline that is a bit more rigid than the neptune tubing in a 1/4" OD, 5/32" ID (1/8" can work too but it's even harder to get on). This is a b!tch to get on the DOS heads, but if you warm the ends of the tubing with boiling water and then put them on the DOS head they will seal nicely.

    Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk
    Whoops. Missed the date.

    Is is your method better than converting the dos to john guest fittings? I'm planning on running 1/4" ro tubing I've got in 100ft sections.

    Thanks

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