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Thread: Topoff lock on for 1 min, but not run more than 5 min. Reset after 10 Min downtime

  1. #1
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    Topoff lock on for 1 min, but not run more than 5 min. Reset after 10 Min downtime

    Hello all!

    I just installed a Kalk reactor, and I want to ensure that the powder at the bottom never gets into the tank. Basically when the ATO float switch opens I want the topoff to come on and lock on for 1 min. I've done this with a defer statement already.

    The part I can't figure out is this. If the float valve does not close in 5 min, I want the topoff pump to shut off and rest for 10 min before running for 5 min again. This is because the water flowing through the reactor kicks up the powder at the bottom and I want to give it a chance to settle out so it doesn't overflow into the tank.

    Do you have ideas on how I might accomplish this? I feel like it's going to require virtual outlets, but I'm not sure what to do with them. I've gotten as far as maybe something like one virtual outlet waits for 5 min to come on once the topoff is on using defer, then the topoff shuts off if that outlet is on, and the topoff has a 10 min defer before it comes back on? My only trouble there is how does it all reset?

    Please help me think through this.
    Whiskey

  2. #2
    Frequent Contributor zombie's Avatar
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    You do indeed need a VO. I also added a second VO that will lock the whole thing out if it gets stuck in the 5 minute cycle for 2 hours this is reset by manually changing ATOlock feom ON back to auto

    ATOpause
    Set OFF
    If Outlet ATOname = ON Then ON
    Defer 005:00 Then ON

    ATOlock
    Set OFF
    If ATOsw CLOSED Then ON
    Defer 120:00 Then ON
    When On > 000:01 Then ON

    ATO
    (Existing code, but delete any defers)
    If Outlet ATOpause = ON Then OFF
    If Outlet ATOlock = ON Then OFF
    Defer 000:10 Then ON
    Min Time 001:00 Then ON
    Min Time 010:00 Then OFF



    You might be an engineer if...You have no life and can prove it mathematically.

  3. #3
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    Very interesting. I had never seen that "When ON" command before. It looks like I need to upgrade my firmware before implementation.

    So the way it works is that the ATOpause waits 5 min to come on, and when it's on then the Topoff Pump is off then once the Topoff pump is turned off it will wait 10 min to come back on.

    Furthermore if the float switch ever stays closed for more than 120 min then then ATOlock virtual outlet will come on, and the When On statement will lock it on until I manually switch it off then back to auto. This condition will prevent the topoff pump from turning on until manual intervention.

    That's fantastic! It will work, and it's fairly simple too. Thank you for the ideas! I'll work on getting my firmware updated so I can use that when statement.

    Whiskey

  4. #4
    Frequent Contributor zombie's Avatar
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    Your description is dead on. That is exactly how it will work. One thing I forgot to mention is that you also want this line in your email so you know when it locks out.

    If Outlet ATOlock = ON Then ON

    You might be an engineer if...You have no life and can prove it mathematically.

  5. #5
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    Great idea! I'll add that as well.

    Tell me, would it be possible to move the Defer 10 min statement to the ATOpause outlet as follows:

    Fallback OFF
    Set OFF
    If Outlet Topoff_8 = ON Then ON
    Defer 005:00 Then ON
    Defer 010:00 Then OFF

    My vision here is that the outlet will wait 5 min to come on (assuming topoff runs that long) then wait 10 min to switch off. Then on the pump outlet I just have:

    If Outlet ATOpause = ON Then ON - leaving out the Defer 10 min then off statement.

    Will the function be exactly the same? The only reason I want to make this minor change is to try and keep the actual pump outlet cleaner.

    Thank you!
    Whiskey

  6. #6
    Frequent Contributor zombie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Whiskey View Post
    Great idea! I'll add that as well.

    Tell me, would it be possible to move the Defer 10 min statement to the ATOpause outlet as follows:

    Fallback OFF
    Set OFF
    If Outlet Topoff_8 = ON Then ON
    Defer 005:00 Then ON
    Defer 010:00 Then OFF

    My vision here is that the outlet will wait 5 min to come on (assuming topoff runs that long) then wait 10 min to switch off. Then on the pump outlet I just have:

    If Outlet ATOpause = ON Then ON - leaving out the Defer 10 min then off statement.

    Will the function be exactly the same? The only reason I want to make this minor change is to try and keep the actual pump outlet cleaner.

    Thank you!
    Whiskey
    Technically yes, but it's better to have it in the ATO outlet itself. The reason for this is that it kills 2 birds with one stone. It prevents the pump from short cycling and also gives you the delay you want when it runs 5 minutes.

    You might be an engineer if...You have no life and can prove it mathematically.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by zombie View Post
    Technically yes, but it's better to have it in the ATO outlet itself. The reason for this is that it kills 2 birds with one stone. It prevents the pump from short cycling and also gives you the delay you want when it runs 5 minutes.

    You might be an engineer if...You have no life and can prove it mathematically.
    Right now I use an optical sensor with a mechanical relay that will "click clack" all the time if the water level is right on the edge, so I have the ATO outlet setup so it turns on right away, but locks on for 1 min once it starts. The reason for this is to avoid the annoying clicking of that relay. This will not be an issue soon because I'm going to the more reliable pressure sensor that Avast uses and I'll connect that to my BOB.

    I'll switch to the other way when I switch the topoff switch, but until then I need to make sure that the pump is not locked out unless there is an issue.

    Thank you!
    Whiskey

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