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Thread: Chiller stopped working after a year !! Unable to get it working in another outlet of the E832

  1. #1
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    Chiller stopped working after a year !! Unable to get it working in another outlet of the E832

    I have a JBJ Artica Chiiler that I have been successfully running for almost a year using one of the outlets on the energy bar (Outlet 3). Suddenly found the chiller not working and temp rising esp. in FL heat.

    Troubleshooting:

    Tried putting other devices in the same outlet like a small fan and it did not turn on when switched outlet ON in Fusion Dashboard or Classic Dashboard - Indicative of that outlet gone bad ?
    Tried hooking up chiller in another outlet (Outlet 7)and it tripped the GFCI.

    Currently running chiller on non energy bar outlet and chiller has been running fine. Just don't want to depend on the temp control of chiller as once it cooled my tank to 60 degrees LoL.

    Are chillers fine to be run on an outlet of Energy Bar 8 ?

    How do I rectify the problem ? Replace Energy Bar 8 ? Add another one ?

  2. #2
    Frequent Contributor zombie's Avatar
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    Depending on the size of the chiller it can only be run on outlet 4 or 8. What size is it?

    You might be an engineer if...You have no life and can prove it mathematically.

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by zombie View Post
    Depending on the size of the chiller it can only be run on outlet 4 or 8. What size is it?
    You might be an engineer if...You have no life and can prove it mathematically.
    Its is JBJ Arctica Titanium Chiller DBM-250 1/3HP. 4 and 8 are relay outputs right ?

  4. #4
    Frequent Contributor zombie's Avatar
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    That one is small enough that it should be fine on any in good condition. It shouldnt pull more than 3 amps.

    If you plug the chiller into a GFCI directly, does it trip it?

    You might be an engineer if...You have no life and can prove it mathematically.

  5. #5
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    It's currently plugged in all of past week or more into the same GFCI and is working fine for more than a week..

  6. #6
    Frequent Contributor zombie's Avatar
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    Just noticed that JBJ was misleading with their hp rating and listed effective cooling rate as 1/3 HP not the compressor rating. It actually draws 7.25 amps peak which is probably why your outlet stopped working. This is within the range of relay outlets 4 or 8. Does it work in one of those?

    You might be an engineer if...You have no life and can prove it mathematically.

  7. #7
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    I will switch to either 4 or 8 tomorrow and test it out. Appreciate your help !!

    I guess there is no way to fix the broken output ? I am already running short on outlets

  8. #8
    Frequent Visitor joenla's Avatar
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    I have a JBJ 1/3HP. i had to purchase a EB4 a while back and use the 12 amp outlet, The problem is its rated at 7 amps but the starting amperage is a lot higher (can't recall how high) and it would keep tripping my breaker on the EB8. It may be overloading your energy bar. I have an EB 832 as well and I tried plugging it in to it and occasionally it gives me the high apm warning so i plugged it back into my EB4.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Yeah like he said use 4 or 8 bc they are rated up to 10 amps (others I believe are only 5 or 7 amps) so if you have a smaller JBJ than 1/3 it may fix your issue.

  9. #9
    Frequent Contributor zombie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by joenla View Post
    I have a JBJ 1/3HP. i had to purchase a EB4 a while back and use the 12 amp outlet, The problem is its rated at 7 amps but the starting amperage is a lot higher (can't recall how high) and it would keep tripping my breaker on the EB8. It may be overloading your energy bar. I have an EB 832 as well and I tried plugging it in to it and occasionally it gives me the high apm warning so i plugged it back into my EB4.
    Starting amperage isn't a problem for a relay contact. I don't know the exact short time rating for the ones neptune uses, but the 10A relays I use in substations are good for 15A for 20 seconds. Starting current decays over 6-12 seconds for most compressors so I would expect it to be over 10A for only a few seconds.

    The one drawback is the make current can cause a little damage from arcing, so it is best to let the JBJs controller rule and have the apex supervise to minimize the arcing damage on the contact.

    You might be an engineer if...You have no life and can prove it mathematically.

  10. #10
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    Thanks for your input esp. about the EB4 current ratings being higher than the EB8 - was not aware of them.

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    Quote Originally Posted by zombie View Post
    The one drawback is the make current can cause a little damage from arcing, so it is best to let the JBJs controller rule and have the apex supervise to minimize the arcing damage on the contact.
    Can you please clarify what do you mean by the above - 'it is best to let the JBJs controller rule and have the apex supervise to minimize the arcing damage on the contact' ?

  12. #12
    Frequent Contributor zombie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chopdeprashant View Post
    Can you please clarify what do you mean by the above - 'it is best to let the JBJs controller rule and have the apex supervise to minimize the arcing damage on the contact' ?
    Here's an example.

    Let's say the chiller is set to 80F and the temp on the chiller matches the apex temp probe, then you would want the outlet programmed something like

    Fallback OFF
    Set ON
    If Temp < 78 Then OFF
    Min Time 060:00 Then OFF

    You might be an engineer if...You have no life and can prove it mathematically.

  13. #13
    Frequent Visitor joenla's Avatar
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    Ahh ok well I'm not an engineer so lets go with what you said
    Yeah thats just what Neptune told me a while back so I purchased their EB4 and its worked beautifully since but your right, no reason the 4 or 8 outlets shouldn't work.

    - - - Updated - - -

    I only use the apex to turn off the outlet if temp goes below 77 so that the outlet isn't cycling on and off constantly, to Zombies point, its better to allow the chiller to cycle on and off using its built in controller and just program the outlet to go off if it goes below your safe point. Matter of fact, i asked JBJ a while back if it was ok to have the apex turn it on and off and they stated that it wasn't a good idea and to allow the built in controller to do the work.

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    Thanks Zombie !! Will program it as above..after you explained it makes sense..to use apex to shut down the chiller not to kick it ON.

  15. #15
    Frequent Visitor joenla's Avatar
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    you may have to look this up to verify but i believe the eb4 has 3 are mech relays at 8A and 1 for larger equipment like chillers is 12A. thats why I purchased it to begin with.

  16. #16
    Frequent Contributor zombie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chopdeprashant View Post
    Thanks !! Will program it as above..after you explained it makes sense..to use apex to shut down the chiller not to kick it ON.
    Glad to help. I'm so used to talking to engineers all day every day, sometimes I forget to not use engineering terminology like supervising.

    You might be an engineer if...You have no life and can prove it mathematically.

  17. #17
    Frequent Contributor zombie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by joenla View Post
    you may have to look this up to verify but i believe the eb4 has 3 are mech relays at 8A and 1 for larger equipment like chillers is 12A. thats why I purchased it to begin with.
    That is correct.

    You might be an engineer if...You have no life and can prove it mathematically.

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    I updated the outlets and switched the chiller to 4 and my return pump to 8.

    The outlet 3 which went bad - last time I checked nothing was turning ON when I plugged into it. When checking yesterday - its now always ON.

    Am I missing configuring something - even when I toggle the outlet OFF - it continues to power my refugium light..

  19. #19
    Frequent Contributor zombie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chopdeprashant View Post
    I updated the outlets and switched the chiller to 4 and my return pump to 8.

    The outlet 3 which went bad - last time I checked nothing was turning ON when I plugged into it. When checking yesterday - its now always ON.

    Am I missing configuring something - even when I toggle the outlet OFF - it continues to power my refugium light..
    The outlet is likely fused closed from being overloaded by the chiller and will need the triac inside to be replaced.

    You might be an engineer if...You have no life and can prove it mathematically.

  20. #20
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    Directed at anybody for help.

    Is it advisable to even plug a chiller in the e832 outlet 4 or 8 just for redundant cut off purposes in case it fails?

    How do I program it. My TECO chiller has its own temp setting to turn it off and on at temperatures between 75.3 to 76.3 F.

    I am looking at the OUtlet 8 > Control Type > Chiller setting, and it gives me the following:

    chiller.jpg

    what should be the on off temp be? or advance setting is necessary in this case?
    When You're a NOOB, You need lots of help all the time

  21. #21
    Master Control Freak RussM's Avatar
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    All outlets on the EB832 are the same; there is nothing different about 4 and 8. Outlets 4 & 8 are different from outlets 1-3 & 5-7 ONLY in an Energy Bar 8.

    The Chiller Control Type is only appropriate to use if you want the chiller to be primarily controlled by the Apex. If you wish to use the chiller's temp controls as primary and only use the Apex only as a safety backup, then you cannot use the Chiller Control type. Instead, use Advanced Control Type, then program it so that the outlet is always ON except if the temperature drops below a certain point.

    Fallback ON
    Set ON
    If Temp < 74.5 Then OFF


    Lastly, your post is a general Apex usage question... this thread was about a specific issue, which it seems that you are not having. Please do not hijack existing threads with something that is different; start a new thread instead.
    Please do not send me PMs with technical questions or requesting assistance - use the forums for Apex help. PM me ONLY if the matter is of a private or personal nature. Thanks.

  22. #22
    Frequent Contributor zombie's Avatar
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    Missed a line russ...

    Min Time 060:00 Then OFF

    You might be an engineer if...You have no life and can prove it mathematically.

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by RussM View Post
    All outlets on the EB832 are the same; there is nothing different about 4 and 8. Outlets 4 & 8 are different from outlets 1-3 & 5-7 ONLY in an Energy Bar 8.

    The Chiller Control Type is only appropriate to use if you want the chiller to be primarily controlled by the Apex. If you wish to use the chiller's temp controls as primary and only use the Apex only as a safety backup, then you cannot use the Chiller Control type. Instead, use Advanced Control Type, then program it so that the outlet is always ON except if the temperature drops below a certain point.

    Fallback ON
    Set ON
    If Temp < 74.5 Then OFF


    Lastly, your post is a general Apex usage question... this thread was about a specific issue, which it seems that you are not having. Please do not hijack existing threads with something that is different; start a new thread instead.


    Thank you. that clear up the cloud. I will do that

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by zombie View Post
    Missed a line russ...

    Min Time 060:00 Then OFF

    You might be an engineer if...You have no life and can prove it mathematically.
    Do i put this line below the IF temp line?
    When You're a NOOB, You need lots of help all the time

  24. #24
    Frequent Contributor zombie's Avatar
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    Yeah at the end. Keeps the chiller from short cycling if it ever gets below the threshold.

    You might be an engineer if...You have no life and can prove it mathematically.

  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by zombie View Post
    Yeah at the end. Keeps the chiller from short cycling if it ever gets below the threshold.

    You might be an engineer if...You have no life and can prove it mathematically.

    Thank you both RusM and Zombie
    When You're a NOOB, You need lots of help all the time

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