Results 1 to 13 of 13

Thread: Programming Safety for Heater

  1. #1
    New User
    Join Date
    Nov 2016
    Location
    US, Pacific Time
    Posts
    2

    Programming Safety for Heater

    I am new to apex programming, and am looking to add a safety feature to keep my heater from staying on continuously should the temperature probe malfunction. Living in Southern California, my heater does not come on often, and when it does usually runs for no more than 15 minutes.

    Any suggestion on code to:
    1. Set a maximum time for the heater to come on (for example 20 minutes)?
    2. Set a lock out until the next time the heater comes on (for example 60 minutes)?
    3. Send an alarm when the heater has been on for "too long"?

    I have the newest version of apex.

    Many thanks,

    Travis

  2. #2
    Frequent Visitor
    Join Date
    Jan 2016
    Location
    Cincinnati, ohio
    Posts
    709
    If your heater has a thermostat, set it for just above the max temp set5ing. That way if the probe fails low and the heater stays on, the internal thermostat of the heater will control.

    also, when the probes fail they either go to 120 or 20. If 120 the normal,program will turn the heater off. Many people use another if temp command if below 70 to turn off.

  3. #3
    Frequent Visitor rkpetersen's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2017
    Location
    Near Seattle
    Posts
    940
    Agree with Frogfish re using the heater's own internal thermostat as a fail-safe, assuming it has one. If no internal thermostat, use a very-low temp OFF command on the heater output instead.

    In addition, I do have an alarm set to activate if any of my 3 heaters (or combination thereof) has been on for 90 minutes continuously. This is the virtual outlet:

    [HeaterErr090]
    Set OFF
    If Output Heater1 = ON Then ON
    If Output Heater2 = ON Then ON
    If Output BackupHeater = ON Then ON
    Defer 090:00 Then ON

    And the email alarm code line:
    If Output HeaterErr090 = ON Then ON

  4. #4
    Regular Vistor
    Join Date
    Apr 2017
    Location
    Eastern
    Posts
    41
    You can also add virtual outlets that will notify you if the temp reads abnormally low. For example, if the probe reads below 60, you likely have a problem. If the heater outlet turns on and the heater doesn't, you have a problem also...therefore, you can make an outlet that will alarm you if the heater current is low. Things like this can help you diagnose a failed or failing heater.

  5. #5
    Frequent Visitor
    Join Date
    Jul 2013
    Location
    Pasadena, Tx
    Posts
    60
    Quote Originally Posted by Engloid View Post
    You can also add virtual outlets that will notify you if the temp reads abnormally low. For example, if the probe reads below 60, you likely have a problem. If the heater outlet turns on and the heater doesn't, you have a problem also...therefore, you can make an outlet that will alarm you if the heater current is low. Things like this can help you diagnose a failed or failing heater.
    What would that Heater on low current statement look like?
    Miracles in Glass Custom 170 (220G), Building a Obsession Custom Sump, Vectra L1, AI Hydra26's, Geo618, Masterflex pump, Apex

  6. #6
    Frequent Contributor zombie's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Location
    Denver, CO
    Posts
    13,176
    Quote Originally Posted by steved350 View Post
    What would that Heater on low current statement look like?
    You would have a virtual outlet along the form of this. The min time is optional and used to prevent annoying recurring alarms every time the heater is called on for heat after a failure.

    HeatFail
    Set OFF
    If Outlet Heater Watts < X Then ON
    Defer 000:30 Then ON
    Min Time 360:00 Then OFF

    You might be an engineer if...You have no life and can prove it mathematically.

  7. #7
    Regular Vistor
    Join Date
    Apr 2017
    Location
    Eastern
    Posts
    41
    Quote Originally Posted by zombie View Post
    You would have a virtual outlet along the form of this. The min time is optional and used to prevent annoying recurring alarms every time the heater is called on for heat after a failure.

    HeatFail
    Set OFF
    If Outlet Heater Watts < X Then ON
    Defer 000:30 Then ON
    Min Time 360:00 Then OFF

    You might be an engineer if...You have no life and can prove it mathematically.
    You can do the same with amps, instead of watts. I use amps for everything.

  8. #8
    Frequent Contributor zombie's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Location
    Denver, CO
    Posts
    13,176
    Quote Originally Posted by Engloid View Post
    You can do the same with amps, instead of watts. I use amps for everything.
    Each has their place. Watts are better for detecting a high rpm condition in pumps because there isn't enough resolution in the amps reading. Watts are also better for very low power draw devices for the same reason. For something like a heater the two are interchangeable and it doesn't matter which you use. The only place I actually use Amps in my alarms is to detect stalled pumps and the reason for that is a stalled pump will draw nearly the same wattage as a healthy pump, but the amps reading will spike 2-6 times healthy values.

    You might be an engineer if...You have no life and can prove it mathematically.

  9. #9
    Addicted
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Location
    44070
    Posts
    14
    Quote Originally Posted by zombie View Post
    You would have a virtual outlet along the form of this. The min time is optional and used to prevent annoying recurring alarms every time the heater is called on for heat after a failure.

    HeatFail
    Set OFF
    If Outlet Heater Watts < X Then ON
    Defer 000:30 Then ON
    Min Time 360:00 Then OFF

    You might be an engineer if...You have no life and can prove it mathematically.

    when using your code would i want to do this first see bold and underlined. Will that say if the heater is in an on state and the watts are below 1 watt than alert?

    Set OFF
    If Output Heater_2_4 = ON Then ON
    If Output Heater_2_5 = ON Then ON
    If Output Heater_2_6 = ON Then ON
    If Output Heater_2_7 = ON Then ON
    If Output HEATER_2_8 = ON Then ON
    If Output Heater_2_4 = Watts < 1 Then ON
    If Output Heater_2_5 = Watts < 1 Then ON
    If Output Heater_2_6 = Watts < 1 Then ON
    If Output Heater_2_7 = Watts < 1 Then ON
    If Output HEATER_2_8 = Watts < 1 Then ON

  10. #10
    Master Control Freak RussM's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2012
    Location
    California - US Pacific
    Posts
    22,463
    No, do not include those lines. That would cause the HeatFail VO to be on anytime any heater is on.
    Please do not send me PMs with technical questions or requesting assistance - use the forums for Apex help. PM me ONLY if the matter is of a private or personal nature. Thanks.

  11. #11
    Addicted
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Location
    44070
    Posts
    14
    Okay thank you I have the following code now

    1 virtual outlet called Heater_Watts
    Set OFF
    If Output Heater_2_4 Watts < 1 Then ON
    If Output Heater_2_5 Watts < 1 Then ON
    If Output Heater_2_6 Watts < 1 Then ON
    If Output Heater_2_7 Watts < 1 Then ON
    If Output HEATER_2_8 Watts < 1 Then ON

    1 outlet called Heaters90Min
    Set OFF
    If Output Heater_2_4 = ON Then ON
    If Output Heater_2_5 = ON Then ON
    If Output Heater_2_6 = ON Then ON
    If Output Heater_2_7 = ON Then ON
    If Output HEATER_2_8 = ON Then ON
    Defer 090:00 Then ON

    and than at the bottom of each of my heaters i have:

    If Output Heaters90Min = ON Then ON
    If Output Heater_Watts = ON Then ON


  12. #12
    Addicted
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Location
    44070
    Posts
    14
    Found out quickly that these 2 lines of code:
    If Output Heaters90Min = ON Then ON
    If Output Heater_Watts = ON Then ON

    DO NOT BELONG on the individual heaters lol
    They belong on the email alert section. All my heaters are on my tanks over its temp im sitting here like


    noticed i put those lines in the heater which would turn them on not send email alerts think its fixed now

  13. #13
    Addicted
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Location
    44070
    Posts
    14
    Looks like my heaters when running can run under 1w? not really sure how thats possible but last night my phone blew up with both alerts. Most of the alerts were the heater under watts alert may have to turn this off and find another way to figure out if a heater has blown.

Similar Threads

  1. Help Programming Heater
    By nyc reefer in forum Apex Programming for Heaters and Chillers
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 02-07-2021, 16:29
  2. Help! Heater Programming
    By CoralNerd in forum Apex Programming for Heaters and Chillers
    Replies: 1
    Last Post: 10-31-2019, 13:15
  3. Question: Heater programming
    By musson in forum Apex Programming for Heaters and Chillers
    Replies: 4
    Last Post: 09-20-2019, 05:48
  4. Programming Heater
    By Hdhuntr01 in forum AquaBus Modules, Probes, and Breakout Boxes
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: 06-14-2014, 15:37
  5. Review My Program Heater Programming
    By fmjets11 in forum Misc Apex Usage & Programming
    Replies: 24
    Last Post: 03-31-2014, 05:20

Bookmarks

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •