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Thread: Trying to use 0-10v

  1. #1
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    Trying to use 0-10v

    Hey all. New Apex 2016. I'm trying to control my VarioS 4 with my apex. I connected the y-cable from the pump controller to the Apex brain and the pump immediately turns off. I can't figure out which variable speed port I'm connected to. All 4 are on auto. I tried turning them on one at a time. I have no clue what I'm doing! I have searched the web and tried following a CoralVue video but again I cant get the pump to turn on. Thanks in advance

  2. #2
    NSI Member rkpetersen's Avatar
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    If you've connected the jack to the leftmost of the two variable out ports on the Apex brain, either variable out 1 or variable out 2 will control the pump, depending on which of the two connectors you hooked up to the pump. If you're not sure which, just toggle each switch to ON briefly, and see which one activates the pump. To get the Apex to control the pump in AUTO mode, you have to program it. Click on the Configuration gear at the upper right of the variable speed pump tile. Should bring up the programming Wizard. You can use this graphical approach, although I prefer to click on the Basic View tab at the upper left, and then program it myself. Here's the code for my VarioS 6 return pump:

    Fallback ON
    Set Ramp020100
    If FeedA 000 Then 14
    If FeedB 000 Then 14
    If FeedC 000 Then 14
    If FeedD 000 Then OFF

    What this does: When I activate Feed A B or C, the pump reduces its output to 14%, which is just enough to keep water barely trickling back into the sump from the overflow. (If you want to use this feature, you'll have to experiment and adjust that percentage based on your particular system.) When I end feed mode, the Profile named Ramp020100 gradually ramps the pump from 20% output back up to 100% over 1 minute, so there's no sudden blast of water from the return nozzle.

  3. #3
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    Yes, this is exactly what I want to do. Thank you. I have to try it and let u know how it goes.

    Quote Originally Posted by rkpetersen View Post
    If you've connected the jack to the leftmost of the two variable out ports on the Apex brain, either variable out 1 or variable out 2 will control the pump, depending on which of the two connectors you hooked up to the pump. If you're not sure which, just toggle each switch to ON briefly, and see which one activates the pump. To get the Apex to control the pump in AUTO mode, you have to program it. Click on the Configuration gear at the upper right of the variable speed pump tile. Should bring up the programming Wizard. You can use this graphical approach, although I prefer to click on the Basic View tab at the upper left, and then program it myself. Here's the code for my VarioS 6 return pump:

    Fallback ON
    Set Ramp020100
    If FeedA 000 Then 14
    If FeedB 000 Then 14
    If FeedC 000 Then 14
    If FeedD 000 Then OFF

    What this does: When I activate Feed A B or C, the pump reduces its output to 14%, which is just enough to keep water barely trickling back into the sump from the overflow. (If you want to use this feature, you'll have to experiment and adjust that percentage based on your particular system.) When I end feed mode, the Profile named Ramp020100 gradually ramps the pump from 20% output back up to 100% over 1 minute, so there's no sudden blast of water from the return nozzle.

  4. #4
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    So my issue was that the y cable wasn't fully plugged into the brain. LOL

  5. #5
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    So I would need to create a ramp profile and add it after SET, correct???

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    Frequent Contributor zombie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rsnyder1456 View Post
    So I would need to create a ramp profile and add it after SET, correct???
    That's one way and the best for pump life ramp up from feed intensity to normal for the set statement and ramp down from normal to feed intensity on the feed statement. You can also just type the percentages now on the newer firmwares but that won't soft start the pump.

    You might be an engineer if...You have no life and can prove it mathematically.

  7. #7
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    Thanks guys. It's working perfectly now! My ATO on the other hand... I may need to start a new thread.?. Switch 1 is staying closed even if I manually lift it out of the water. switch 2 does open and close when I lift it out of the water and put it back in. I just wanted to test it out. The module has a minimum time of 60 minutes then off. And the outlet when set to ATO has a defer one minute then on.

  8. #8
    Frequent Contributor zombie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rsnyder1456 View Post
    Thanks guys. It's working perfectly now! My ATO on the other hand... I may need to start a new thread.?. Switch 1 is staying closed even if I manually lift it out of the water. switch 2 does open and close when I lift it out of the water and put it back in. I just wanted to test it out. The module has a minimum time of 60 minutes then off. And the outlet when set to ATO has a defer one minute then on.
    Floats or optical sensors?

    You might be an engineer if...You have no life and can prove it mathematically.

  9. #9
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    It's the Neptune ATK with the two optical sensors and third float switch

  10. #10
    Frequent Contributor zombie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rsnyder1456 View Post
    It's the Neptune ATK with the two optical sensors and third float switch
    Make sure they are configured for optical and not auto-detect, they are clean, and the connector is pressed all the way in.

    You might be an engineer if...You have no life and can prove it mathematically.

  11. #11
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    ok I'll check

  12. #12
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    Sorry but I can't find where to do that. Under inputs? Or tasks? Looked at both

  13. #13
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    Ok found it under modules. It WAS set to auto detect but said that it detected both optical sensors. I unchecked auto detect and manually selected optical. Gonna test again

  14. #14
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    PROBLEM SOLVED! Thank you

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    i am going to try this do i put this in at the top before the existing program or can i add it to the bottom & do i need to put in the Fallback ON mime has fall back off at the beginning now

  16. #16
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    I believe you would want Fallback ON because if it's your return pump and the EB8 lost communication with fusion, you'd want the return pump to fallback to the ON position. And I don't know what your existing program is but I BELIEVE
    Fallback ON
    Set Ramp020100
    If FeedA 000 Then 14
    If FeedB 000 Then 14
    If FeedC 000 Then 14
    If FeedD 000 Then OFF would replace whatever was there originally

    I had to adjust my feed number to 30 to stop my return from back siphoning BUT I AM BRAND NEW AT THIS SO TAKE THAT INTO CONSIDERATION!

    Quote Originally Posted by Daveontario View Post
    i am going to try this do i put this in at the top before the existing program or can i add it to the bottom & do i need to put in the Fallback ON mime has fall back off at the beginning now

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  18. #18
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    That is beyond me at this point! Maybe start a new thread? Or wait and see if any of the other guys reply
    Quote Originally Posted by Daveontario View Post

  19. #19
    Master Control Freak RussM's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rsnyder1456 View Post
    I believe you would want Fallback ON because if it's your return pump and the EB8 lost communication with fusion, you'd want the return pump to fallback to the ON position.
    Fallback has nothing to do with Fusion communications, nor does an EB8 or any other module communicate with APEX Fusion. Modules communicate with the Apex base unit via Aquabus. The Apex communicates with the Fusion cloud via the Internet. One does not depend on the other. Please see this sticky: https://forum.neptunesystems.com/sho...About-FALLBACK
    I'm not a Neptune support rep. Please do not send me PMs with technical questions or requesting assistance - use the forums for Apex help. PM me ONLY if the matter is of a private or personal nature. Thanks.

  20. #20
    Frequent Contributor zombie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rsnyder1456 View Post
    I believe you would want Fallback ON because if it's your return pump and the EB8 lost communication with fusion, you'd want the return pump to fallback to the ON position. And I don't know what your existing program is but I BELIEVE
    Fallback ON
    Set Ramp020100
    If FeedA 000 Then 14
    If FeedB 000 Then 14
    If FeedC 000 Then 14
    If FeedD 000 Then OFF would replace whatever was there originally

    I had to adjust my feed number to 30 to stop my return from back siphoning BUT I AM BRAND NEW AT THIS SO TAKE THAT INTO CONSIDERATION!

    Fallback doesn't work on base unit variable speed ports. It does work on a VDM module, but the choice between ON and OFF is not as straightforward with a 0-10V pump. Since you are limited to 100% and 0% Fallback ON might not be the best choice because if the pump is seriously oversized (not the case for this one because normal is 100%) then it can fill faster than it can drain and leave a mess on your floor.

    You might be an engineer if...You have no life and can prove it mathematically.

  21. #21
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    Ok thank you Russ and Zombie. I will read that thread you mentioned.

  22. #22
    NSI Member rkpetersen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by zombie View Post
    Fallback doesn't work on base unit variable speed ports.
    Right. I should have specified in my first post that the Fallback line only works with the VDM module, which is how I use it. rsnyder, It won't work with the variable out ports on the Apex base controller, because if that controller fails, its variable out ports also fail regardless of any programming. A VDM which continues to get power from the bus should still work.

    Although I actually had a question about this for RussM and zombie -

    For the VDM variable out to have programmed on/off functioning during a fallback condition, can its aquabus connection to the EB pass through the Apex controller, or should it bypass the controller (go directly to the EB832 or through other modules) ?

  23. #23
    Frequent Contributor zombie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rkpetersen View Post
    For the VDM variable out to have programmed on/off functioning during a fallback condition, can its aquabus connection to the EB pass through the Apex controller, or should it bypass the controller (go directly to the EB832 or through other modules) ?
    Makes no difference under normal circumstances. It's slightly more reliable to come straight from the base unit because you have only 1 cable failure to cause comms loss instead of multiple possibilities, but the chances of that are terribly low anyway. Module failure along the way won't effect It, only disconnected or damaged cable.

    You might be an engineer if...You have no life and can prove it mathematically.

  24. #24
    NSI Member rkpetersen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by zombie View Post
    Module failure along the way won't effect It
    Thanks, that was my main concern.

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