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Thread: Programming a water change

  1. #1
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    Programming a water change

    I am not sure that any of what I am about to ask is doable but I thought I would ask just in case it was. I also did a search for something that would be similar to what I was thinking about but could not find anything that I thought would fit. To be honest, I am not very good at programming so I question whether I would be able to recognize the correct programming if I did find it. Anyway, I can’t imagine that I would be the 1st person to think about doing this, so if there is a link to another thread that does what I am looking to do, I would really appreciate it if you would be willing to share the link or provide me with the search criteria.

    Just recently I installed a dedicated pump in my sump to assist with weekly water changes. The pump is plumed directly to my house sewer drain lines and when turned on will expel 17 gallons of water in just a few minutes. Currently I have the pump plugged into one of my EB8’s and I manually turn it on and off with my iPad. The problem is that prior to pumping out the sump, I have to manually turn off the outputs that control my return pump, ATS pump, 2 ATS lights, skimmer feed pump, 2 heaters and my ATO. Then once I have drained the sump and refilled it with fresh saltwater, I manually turn all the outputs back on.

    What I would like assistance with is: The programming of a single switch (maybe a virtual switch?) that I would be able to turn on and it would first signal to turn off a number of outputs (return, skimmer, ATS…), then once everything is off, wait 45 sec and then turn on the WC pump for determined amount of time and then turn off the pump. Once the sump is refilled, I would then turn the switch off and this action would then result in all of the prior outputs being turned back on. For an added wish, I would also like (if possible) the turning off and turning on of the outputs to be timed apart so that output # 1 turns off/on, wait 20sec, then output # 2 turns off/on, wait 20 sec, then output #3…….. so on and so forth.

    Lastly, for future expansion, I purchased a 165g vessel which I am planning on adding to my system as a fresh saltwater vat. This will facilitate my daily 1.5g water changes and also a monthly 17g water change which is my weekly water change now. I haven’t finished the setup yet as I am still putting together my 165g saltwater vat. But once that is complete, my finalized plan is to have a dual head Stenner peristaltic pump for the daily water changes and also have another pump which will pull water from the vat and refill the sump when I do my monthly 17g water changes. My additional hope is that the monthly water changes can be controlled by float switches or electronic eyes and be fully automated. This would mean that when the switch is activated, the pump and light outputs will turn off, then the 1st pumps will drain, turn off and then the second pump will fill. All of this will be according to time and also floats or electronic eyes (or both), then when the drain and fill is complete, the pump and light outputs will turn back on.

    Anyway, am I crazy in my thinking or can this actually be done.

    Thank you in advance for your help and assistance,
    Tom G

  2. #2
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    Since I posted the original post, I have made a bit of progress with the generous help of others. I keep thinking that I surely couldn’t be the only one to struggle with this so I thought that I would share my journey.

    The first step I made was clearing up some of the repetitious modules found in my setup - https://forum.neptunesystems.com/sho...ule-Setup-quot

    Next, I was helped to better understand how to make a virtual outlet, the role that control addresses play in creating a virtual switch, and also identify what I referred to as mystery switches on my Dashboard. - https://forum.neptunesystems.com/sho...utlet-Question

    How does all of this fit into helping me set up a virtual switch to facilitate a semi-automated water change? Well, it helped me better understand how a switch works and what it does. This was probably the most important thing that I have discovered. When I first posted, I thought that all of the programming to control a device with a virtual switch was supposed to be done at the virtual switch itself. That you would make a long program where you identified each device and below the identifying description was the programming for how it should act when the virtual switch was activated. That thought process was completely wrong and that was my hang-up. For me, the main reason for this flawed thought process was how pg. 158 of the Apex Comprehensive Reference Manual referenced the programming of the 2 pumps and an ATO in their “Automatic Water Change” program example. It appeared to me, when I read over the example, that all of the programming was a run-on program and was divided by the identifier of the switch (ie [SW_Drain_Pump]) but instead, what was being provided was the programming for each switch. When I realized this tidbit of information, that the programming to alter the state of a devices is actually within the programming of each device itself, everything started to make sense. For instance, in my case, a virtual switch was created using the EB8 platform (see pg. 113 of the Apex Comprehensive Reference Manual). These 8 switches don't actually change the state of a device but are a signal to other devices that have programming within them to signal they need to change because the virtual switch has changed its state.

    Here is how I went about programming my devices using a virtual switch:

    1. I created a virtual switch on the Classic Web page (not Fusion) by going to: Configuration>Module setup. From there, about mid page I selected a Direct Connect 8 (DC8) in the “Add Module” dropdown. Then I chose the “Start Control Address” to be begin at A1 (see more on how to choose a correct Control Address number on pg. 113 of the Apex Comprehensive Reference Manual). Then I checked the “Add Module” button and returned to the dashboard.

    2. At the Dashboard, I found 8 new switches. Since I was only going to use one switch for this application, I renamed switches 2 thru 8 so that they could not be confused for another. The name doesn’t really matter as long as it doesn’t conflict with another switch. For my application, I named the switches Virtual_A2, Virtual_A3, all the way to A8. I named the first switch “MAINT_WC”.

    3. I programmed the virtual switch MAINT_WC –

    Fallback OFF
    Set OFF

    4. I began programming the devices that I wanted to control or change the state of when the MAINT_WC switch was turned on.
    For the pumps, which consist of my return, ATS feed pump, and my PS feed pump, I used the following –

    Return Pump Program
    Fallback ON
    Set ON
    If Output MAINT_WC = ON Then OFF
    Defer 000:10 Then ON

    ATS Feed Pump Program
    Fallback ON
    Set ON
    If Output MAINT_WC = ON Then OFF
    Defer 000:30 Then ON

    PS Feed Pump Program
    Fallback ON
    Set ON
    If Output MAINT_WC = ON Then OFF
    Defer 000:50 Then ON

    As you see, the only difference between the programming of the 3 pumps was the Defer length of time. I made it so the return would defer 10 sec after the MAINT_WC switch was turned off, the ATS feed pump would defer 30 sec, and the PS feed would defer 50 sec. I staggered the start up of the pumps because I use AC pumps and I did not want a spike in amperage to my EB8 like I would see if all the pumps came on at one time.

    5. I programmed my 2 heaters. One heater comes on between 79° & 80° and the other comes on between 78° & 79°. I also deferred them for a length of time after the MAINT_WC switch was turned on so that they had time to acclimate to the possible change in water temp as a result of the large volume water change. The programming for them looks like this –

    Heater 1 & 2 Programming
    Fallback OFF
    If D_Tmp < 79.0 Then ON
    If D_Tmp > 80.0 Then OFF
    If Output MAINT_WC = ON Then OFF
    Defer 003:00 Then ON

    Well, that is where I am at at the moment. I am currently working on programming for the water change discharge pump but don’t quite have it worked out yet. But when I do, I will share how it worked out.

    Thanks for looking.
    Tom G

  3. #3
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    Here is what I was able to come up with for the pump that I have placed in my sump to turn on and drain my sump when the virtual switch is activated. The one variable with this pump is that I would like it to defer 60 sec before turning on and pumping out the sump. This would give time for drain down of the display, PS and ATS. Additionally, I also only want the pump to remain on for a defined period of time (4 min) and then shut off regardless of the state of the virtual switch.

    Here is what I have come up with so far –

    Fallback OFF
    Set OFF
    If Output MAINT_WC = ON Then ON
    Defer 001:00 Then ON
    Min Time 005:00 Then OFF

    ***NOTE: MAINT_WC is my virtual switch***

    Let me know what you think and if your think it is going to work,
    Tom G

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