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Thread: Utilize DOS for Display to Frag tank Plumbing?

  1. #1
    Regular Vistor robocop1906's Avatar
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    Utilize DOS for Display to Frag tank Plumbing?

    Would this work as an alternative to hard plumbing the Main Display to a frag tank? Thoughts?
    DOS-Frag.PNG

  2. #2
    Frequent Contributor zombie's Avatar
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    I would hard plumb. The DOS is only capable of a maximum of 30 gallons per day and your frag tank should be getting 3x volume turnover per hour.

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    Regular Vistor robocop1906's Avatar
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    It's only 10gal, what if I keep the current filter power head running?

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    Are you going to try this? I was thinking about doing the same thing with one of those 25 gallon all-in-one frag tanks. I'd just run the return pump within the frag tank with nothing else except a heater. Then exchange maybe 15 gallons per day of water between the two tanks and do all the dosing, skimming, etc in the main tank.

    Any reason why this wouldn't work?

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    Frequent Contributor zombie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gobble View Post
    Are you going to try this? I was thinking about doing the same thing with one of those 25 gallon all-in-one frag tanks. I'd just run the return pump within the frag tank with nothing else except a heater. Then exchange maybe 15 gallons per day of water between the two tanks and do all the dosing, skimming, etc in the main tank.

    Any reason why this wouldn't work?
    Personally I would hard plumb so you can take full advantage of the larger water volume. At 15 gallons per day, the DOS will be very loud and you would need to change heads every couple months.

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    Hard plumb means large holes through my hardwood floor vs. RO tubing through the wall. Would a 5 gallon exchange per day be enough to keep the two tanks with similar parameters?

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    Regular Vistor robocop1906's Avatar
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    I believe it will work. Maybe not ideal but some setups won't allow for plumbing or it's just plain undesired. It's all speculation until someone does it and report back results. I'm sure it gets complicated with tank size and what's stocked in the tank but testing both systems periodically to see if the parameters match would really tell the story. I considered this approach after researching and seeing how complicated and flood risky it is hard plumbing. I couldn't find a good template for my setup so this idea popped in my head. I'm in the planning phase but do plan to take this approach when I'm at the point of execution.

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    I think worst case you need to do a little extra dosing to the frag tank. Now the trick is to find a smaller sized all-in-one frag tank. Most of them (JBJ, IM) seem to be discontinued.

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    Frequent Contributor zombie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gobble View Post
    Hard plumb means large holes through my hardwood floor vs. RO tubing through the wall. Would a 5 gallon exchange per day be enough to keep the two tanks with similar parameters?
    You could do a happy medium and do sharkbite connectors to 1/2" CPVC.

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    That would allow for a larger volume but what would I use to equalize the water being pumped to and from the frag tank? I don’t think I can put some sort of overflow on the sump of my reefer 450?

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    The other thing too when I put my display tank into feed mode and the return pump shuts off, if this was simply done by overflow my frag tank would flood.

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    Frequent Contributor zombie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gobble View Post
    That would allow for a larger volume but what would I use to equalize the water being pumped to and from the drag tank? I don’t think I can put some sort of overflow on the sump of my reefer 450?
    You would equalize using an overflow on the frag tank and pump water from the red sea sump to it with either a dedicated pump or a manifold off your main line.

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    I think that only works if the frag tank sits higher then the display tank sump. My frag tank is in my basement.

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    Frequent Contributor zombie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gobble View Post
    I think that only works if the frag tank sits higher then the display tank sump. My frag tank is in my basement.
    Gotcha. Now I see why you thought it was impossible. In that case it may be worth considering the 3 head setup where you use 1 head to add new water to the display, 1 head to move water from the display to the frag, and 1 to move from the frag to the drain. This isolates any pests from making it from the frag to the main display and gives you an extra head to use for something else.

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    Quote Originally Posted by zombie View Post
    Gotcha. Now I see why you thought it was impossible. In that case it may be worth considering the 3 head setup where you use 1 head to add new water to the display, 1 head to move water from the display to the frag, and 1 to move from the frag to the drain. This isolates any pests from making it from the frag to the main display and gives you an extra head to use for something else.

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    I thought about that too and isolating the frag tank from the main but using the main's waste water. The only downside is I'd like to exchange as much water as possible and if it goes from the main to the frag to the drain I don't really want to dump 5 or more gallons of saltwater down the drain every day.

    I suppose you could get crazy with this setup and run two DOS units to double up the volume of water exchange. Or maybe there are other accurate pumps that can do a larger water volume per day?

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    Frequent Contributor zombie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gobble View Post
    I thought about that too and isolating the frag tank from the main but using the main's waste water. The only downside is I'd like to exchange as much water as possible and if it goes from the main to the frag to the drain I don't really want to dump 5 or more gallons of saltwater down the drain every day.

    I suppose you could get crazy with this setup and run two DOS units to double up the volume of water exchange. Or maybe there are other accurate pumps that can do a larger water volume per day?
    Depends on what your goal is. If the goal is to equalize parameters between the two so you can drop frags with no risk of pH or ALK shock, 25% weekly change from the display to the frag is all you really need. If your display is 3x larger or more this is a cinch to achieve with the 3 head method. If the goal is to create a giant water volume, the larger change is beneficial, but comes at the cost of regular head replacements.

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    Regular Vistor robocop1906's Avatar
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    I have a 150g display with a 10gal frag. I don't have a place to auto dump old water so the original illustration would work for me. Plus I may move away from water changes altogether. With my ratio being 15 times smaller than display would 5gal /day be a reasonable start?

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    Frequent Contributor zombie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by robocop1906 View Post
    I have a 150g display with a 10gal frag. I don't have a place to auto dump old water so the original illustration would work for me. Plus I may move away from water changes altogether. With my ratio being 15 times smaller than display would 5gal /day be a reasonable start?
    2 gallons a day would be adequate with the 3 head method or 5 would be good with the exchange method.

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    You got me thinking and I believe I have a much better idea then what I was planning in the basement.

    Why not put the small frag tank next to the main tank and simply share the sump of the main tank? I could buy the IM Lagoon 25 EXT and simply run hoses to my main sump. To not upset the balance I could use a very low volume return pump and turn the water volume every hour or so.

    Make sense?

    IMG_0224.jpg

    IMG_0728.jpg

  20. #20
    Frequent Contributor zombie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gobble View Post
    You got me thinking and I believe I have a much better idea then what I was planning in the basement.

    Why not put the small frag tank next to the main tank and simply share the sump of the main tank? I could buy the IM Lagoon 25 EXT and simply run hoses to my main sump. To not upset the balance I could use a very low volume return pump and turn the water volume every hour or so.

    Make sense?

    IMG_0224.jpg

    IMG_0728.jpg
    That sounds like a better idea. I would go with that.

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  21. #21
    Regular Vistor robocop1906's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by zombie View Post
    2 gallons a day would be adequate with the 3 head method or 5 would be good with the exchange method.

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    Would I still need a separate filter for the frag tank or would the water exchange be enough? Maybe if I up'ed the gallons/day exchange to eliminate the need for a separate filter?

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    You would want something in there. I would suggest something like a few marine pure blocks or similar to handle spikes in ammonia.

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