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Thread: battery back up

  1. #1
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    battery back up

    i am new to the apex and noticed that the system runs on 12v dc
    how or can you hook up a 12v marine battery to this system as back up
    sort of like a back up for you sump in alot of houses

    thanks in advance for the help

  2. #2
    Master Control Freak RussM's Avatar
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    The issue with using a marine battery is that you need to keep it charged manually, and they are relatively bulky. You can use a small but quality UPS and a 12v adapter. Or pick up a Belkin BU3DC001-12V on ebay - it will plug right into the Apex - they are compact, and the easiest and least expensive solution.

  3. #3
    Frequent Contributor jrlamountain's Avatar
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    Re: battery back up

    How long will the belkin UPC run the apex?

    Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk HD

  4. #4
    Master Control Freak RussM's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jrlamountain View Post
    How long will the belkin UPC run the apex?
    I really don;'t know... I use a UPS which will power my Apex, router, switch, and cable modem for about 4 hours. But I suspect taht the Belkin unit will power the Apex base unit alone for quite a few hours.

    Of course, in order to be notified of a power outage by the Apex via email, your Apex, wireless adapter (if used), router, and cable/DSL modem all must have backup power.

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    sorry for bring dumb, but what is a ups?????

    as far as a battery I have that squared away like I do with my classic cars small trickle / controller that puts out .5amps to regen battery then shuts off
    works great for them long winters when I don't drive them

    marine or deep cycles that I get will power a car for 375 min., mind you that's a lot more electronics running than my reef tank set up
    and yes my wireless will be hooked into the back up battery and not the main router

  6. #6
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    A UPS is an uninterruptible power supply, basically a big battery.

    here is the one I just bought: http://www.amazon.com/CyberPower-CP8...er+power+cp850

    i actually bought two. One is on my PC powering the modem, router and tower, the other is behind my tank powering one of my EB8's.

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    so for UPS you recc the Belkin BU3DC001-12V?
    i tried using the
    CyberPower CP600LCD Intelligent LCD UPS 600VA 340W Compact and it shorted the UPS out

  8. #8
    Master Control Freak RussM's Avatar
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    battery back up

    Quote Originally Posted by senior roboto View Post
    so for UPS you recc the Belkin BU3DC001-12V?
    i tried using the
    CyberPower CP600LCD Intelligent LCD UPS 600VA 340W Compact and it shorted the UPS out
    What shorted out the UPS?
    Please do not send me PMs with technical questions or requesting assistance - use the forums for Apex help. PM me ONLY if the matter is of a private or personal nature. Thanks.

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    Quote Originally Posted by RussM View Post
    What shorted out the UPS?
    the EB8. i was plugging everything up and heard a pop then it smoked a little and no longer worked. i took it apart and replaced the fuse but it still wont power up.
    didnt know if there was something more suited for the job to run all of that for a few hours.
    i work very long days, sometimes 24hr shifts. so having the ability to get a text when something goes wrong is great. power outages included.

  10. #10
    Master Control Freak RussM's Avatar
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    battery back up

    Was the EB8 the first thing you plugged into the UPS? I'm assuming that you've had the EB8 plugged to a regular outlet without problems. If so, sounds like you got a defective UPS.
    Please do not send me PMs with technical questions or requesting assistance - use the forums for Apex help. PM me ONLY if the matter is of a private or personal nature. Thanks.

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    Quote Originally Posted by RussM View Post
    Was the EB8 the first thing you plugged into the UPS? I'm assuming that you've had the EB8 plugged to a regular outlet without problems. If so, sounds like you got a defective UPS.
    i have had the EB8 and the UPS working before i tried this.
    either way, what UPS do you recc me getting to power up my EB8? one that would last a few hours? at max power my bar is pulling about 4.2 amps

  12. #12
    Master Control Freak RussM's Avatar
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    battery back up

    4.2 amps is about 480 watts under ideal conditions - significantly higher than the rating if that UPS. You may have blown the UPS by overloading it.

    If you want to power your full system for several hours, you'll need a much bigger (read as: expensive) UPS.
    Please do not send me PMs with technical questions or requesting assistance - use the forums for Apex help. PM me ONLY if the matter is of a private or personal nature. Thanks.

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    Quote Originally Posted by RussM View Post
    4.2 amps is about 480 watts under ideal conditions - significantly higher than the rating if that UPS. You may have blown the UPS by overloading it.

    If you want to power your full system for several hours, you'll need a much bigger (read as: expensive) UPS.
    yeah thought i might have lol. well unless you know some coding for the apex to where it would only run the return pump if there was a loss in power? or would that not matter cause it still would be pulling 480 thru it even if it wasnt using the battery?

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    You can test for a loss of power if you have a single EB8, you just need the 12v adapter for supplemental power. You plug that into the wall and when the Apex sees that go to 0 you can shut down outlets but....

    I think your problem will be that for a couple of seconds you will put your entire load on the UPS. That will probably cause it to trip anyway. The controller can shut down the outlets in 1 - 2 seconds but I don't know if your UPS could take the full load for that long. Something to check out.
    Al

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    yes this something that i want to do, i only have one EB8 but not that extra 12v adapter(i dont think, unless it comes with the Apex Lite).
    the reason i am so bothered with a random power outage is because they are putting a brand new 8 story building next to where i live. they may have to kill the power to the block on purpose or accident for an extended ammount of time. i would like to know when it happens. already got a UPS for my modem and router.

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    Quote Originally Posted by RussM View Post
    4.2 amps is about 480 watts under ideal conditions - significantly higher than the rating if that UPS. You may have blown the UPS by overloading it.

    If you want to power your full system for several hours, you'll need a much bigger (read as: expensive) UPS.
    So if I get to about 3 amps pull on my E8 then I'm pushing my 350 watt UPS? Will it fail even while the power is connected or just when the power goes out?

  17. #17
    Master Control Freak RussM's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fishinwall View Post
    So if I get to about 3 amps pull on my E8 then I'm pushing my 350 watt UPS? Will it fail even while the power is connected or just when the power goes out?
    Yes, that's near capacity, if in fact you have a 350 watt UPS; but most UPSs (including the APC 350, which you said you have in another thread) are rated in VA (volt-amperes) which is not that same as watts. For example, the current model APC Back-UPS 350 has a rated load capacity of 210 watts. If you push the rated limit, you will get minimal run-time. Frankly, that little UPS is really only good for powering the Apex itself, and perhaps a small powerhead.
    Please do not send me PMs with technical questions or requesting assistance - use the forums for Apex help. PM me ONLY if the matter is of a private or personal nature. Thanks.

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    Quote Originally Posted by RussM View Post
    Yes, that's near capacity, if in fact you have a 350 watt UPS; but most UPSs (including the APC 350, which you said you have in another thread) are rated in VA (volt-amperes) which is not that same as watts. For example, the current model APC Back-UPS 350 has a rated load capacity of 210 watts. If you push the rated limit, you will get minimal run-time. Frankly, that little UPS is really only good for powering the Apex itself, and perhaps a small powerhead.

    Oh gosh. Yes I see it is 257 watts. My apex is reading at max 2.6 amps. So is it dangerous to have it plugged in even while the power is on? Hmm this sticks. I was hoping I could program my Apex to shut down everything on the E8 when it detects power failure from the 12v adapter, then have my MP10 plugged into the backup as well and when I get a power out text I could connect via reef link and drop my MP 10 to 20%.

  19. #19
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    Don't trust the amp reading to be completely accurate. List what is plugged into it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by senior roboto View Post
    yeah thought i might have lol. well unless you know some coding for the apex to where it would only run the return pump if there was a loss in power? or would that not matter cause it still would be pulling 480 thru it even if it wasnt using the battery?
    If you only want to run the return pump, just get an Ecotech Vectra and battery backup. Or it could be cheaper to just get a dedicated EB8 or 4 and put only the return pump on it.

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by zombie View Post
    Don't trust the amp reading to be completely accurate. List what is plugged into it.
    This is what is in my E8:
    Ehiem 1250
    octopus 1000 int
    two 150 watt heaters but usually only one goes on
    ato just an aqua-lifter
    sump led light
    thats it.


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    I have a tunze 6105.50 connected to a 12V 18AH battery on a trickle charger for powr outages. the problem is that if my Apex classic loses power the 0-10V port shuts my 6105 off. can I just connect the 12V power port on the Apex to the same 18AH 12V battery? is it a standard 5.5mm connector? what is the pinout? thanks

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by five.five-six View Post
    I have a tunze 6105.50 connected to a 12V 18AH battery on a trickle charger for powr outages. the problem is that if my Apex classic loses power the 0-10V port shuts my 6105 off. can I just connect the 12V power port on the Apex to the same 18AH 12V battery? is it a standard 5.5mm connector? what is the pinout? thanks
    Maybe. Can you read the voltage while charging and while not charging on a multimeter? If it's not within 11.4 to 12.6 V I would not risk doing so as the apex circuit boards are pretty succeptable to over and under voltage just like a computer. If it's out of bounds (which I expect it will be) I would suggest getting a 12V power supply and a small UPS. Plug the apex aux power into that as well as your router. Aquabus and most routers use very little power so even a $50 UPS from best buy should last about 8 hours.

    You might be an engineer if...You have no life and can prove it mathematically.

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    12.6V? Wow, that's a really low upper threshold for a 12V rated device I'll have to get my fluke out. perhaps shunt it with a zener diode if needed.

  25. #25
    Frequent Contributor zombie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by five.five-six View Post
    12.6V? Wow, that's a really low upper threshold for a 12V rated device I'll have to get my fluke out. perhaps shunt it with a zener diode if needed.
    I don't know the exact limits but the only 100% safe limits of the SMEBA curve (used for over under voltage characteristics to guarantee a computer will not ever be damaged from the utility side) is +-5% hence the 11.4 to 12.6. I haven't done enough research on the subject to know if there are additional over under voltage allowable from the power supply that would increase the bus voltage threshold so +-10% may also be okay, but I would do your research first if it's more than 5% off nominal at the battery.

    You might be an engineer if...You have no life and can prove it mathematically.

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